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PodcastyBiznes"Econ 102" with Noah Smith and Erik Torenberg

"Econ 102" with Noah Smith and Erik Torenberg

Turpentine
"Econ 102" with Noah Smith and Erik Torenberg
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  • China, Tesla, and the Electric Tech Stack Revolution
    This week, Noah Smith and Erik Torenberg discuss China’s economic strategies, technological advancements, and geopolitical challenges, contrasting them with U.S. policy. They discuss topics from the Hong Kong protests to battery manufacturing and emphasize the need for American industrial policy, education reform, and strategic investment to stay competitive. – SPONSORS: NetSuite More than 41,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, the #1 cloud financial system bringing accounting, financial management, inventory, HR, into ONE proven platform. Download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine learning: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://netsuite.com/102⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Shopify Shopify is the world's leading e-commerce platform, offering a market-leading checkout system Shoppay and exclusive AI apps. Nobody does selling better than Shopify. Get a $1 per month trial at ⁠https://shopify.com/momentofzen⁠. AdQuick The easiest way to book out-of-home ads (like billboards, vehicle wraps, and airport displays) the same way you would order an Uber. Ready to get your brand the attention it deserves? Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://adquick.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ today to start reaching your customers in the real world. – SEND US YOUR Q's FOR NOAH TO ANSWER ON AIR: [email protected] – FOLLOW ON X: @noahpinion @eriktorenberg @turpentinemedia – RECOMMENDED IN THIS EPISODE: Is the U.S. in a "high-level equilibrium trap"?: https://www.noahpinion.blog/p/is-the-us-in-a-high-level-equilibrium Noahpinion: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.noahpinion.blog/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  – TAKEAWAYS: China's Strategic Position & Capabilities: China can easily police sea lanes to protect their own trade while potentially disrupting others, giving them a significant strategic advantage over America's traditional role as a global public goods provider. Financial System Stress: China faces a persistent drag from their real estate crash and mounting bad debt in local government financing vehicles. Banks are struggling to transition from real estate lending to manufacturing loans, many of which will likely go bad. Electric Tech Stack Revolution: The convergence of lithium-ion batteries, permanent magnet electric motors, and power electronics is creating a new technological paradigm that's replacing combustion engineering across multiple industries. America's Manufacturing Challenge: America has "too many bottlenecks" - only Elon Musk seems capable of overwhelming all 20+ bottlenecks simultaneously, while other talented entrepreneurs can only handle 15 or fewer. Republican Industrial Policy: America needs "Biden-style industrial policy without the everything bagel" - massive subsidies and support for electric tech manufacturing without progressive contractor requirements and community engagement processes. China's Innovation Plateau: By the 2040s, China may face Japan's experience where aging leadership in corporations reduces innovation and creates fewer opportunities for young talent.
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  • Cost Disease, USAID Debate, and is Curtis Yarvin Trapped in 2020
    This week, Noah Smith and Erik Torenberg explore persistent economic myths and recent developments—from cost disease in services like healthcare and education to stagnating manufacturing productivity, rising higher education costs, drug pricing policies, and student loan debates—while also reflecting on broader intellectual shifts driven by culture wars and foreign aid discussions. – SPONSORS: NetSuite More than 41,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, the #1 cloud financial system bringing accounting, financial management, inventory, HR, into ONE proven platform. Download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine learning: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://netsuite.com/102⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ AdQuick The easiest way to book out-of-home ads (like billboards, vehicle wraps, and airport displays) the same way you would order an Uber. Ready to get your brand the attention it deserves? Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://adquick.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ today to start reaching your customers in the real world. – SEND US YOUR Q's FOR NOAH TO ANSWER ON AIR: [email protected] – FOLLOW ON X: @noahpinion @eriktorenberg @turpentinemedia – RECOMMENDED IN THIS EPISODE: Noahpinion: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.noahpinion.blog/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  – TAKEAWAYS: Healthcare & Education Cost Trends Reversing: Healthcare price growth has slowed significantly since 2009 and is now growing slower than average costs. Technology's Role in Services: AI potentially solving education through personalized one-on-one tutoring (referencing "The Diamond Age"). Student Loans & Market Dynamics: Marginal students are dropping out of college, reducing demand. Pharmaceutical Pricing: Americans actually pay less on average for pharmaceuticals due to cheaper generics. Cultural Commentary: Discussing intellectual debates between prominent thinkers (Tyler Cowen vs. Scott Alexander on foreign aid, Scott Alexander vs. Curtis Yarvin on governance), emphasizing the importance of not getting trapped in the cultural moment of 2020-2021.
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  • Noah Smith & Matt Yglesias on the Electric Technology Crisis, China, and America's Future
    This week, we're republishing a conversation Noah Smith and Matt Yglesias hosted live on Substack this past Monday. They revisit a wide-ranging conversation on the transformative role of electric motors, batteries, and industrial policy in a politically polarized era, touching on the history of energy, global economic competition, AI regulation, the Inflation Reduction Act, Democratic strategy, and the need to redefine America’s identity amid demographic shifts. – SPONSORS: NetSuite More than 41,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, the #1 cloud financial system bringing accounting, financial management, inventory, HR, into ONE proven platform. Download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine learning: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://netsuite.com/102⁠⁠⁠⁠ AdQuick The easiest way to book out-of-home ads (like billboards, vehicle wraps, and airport displays) the same way you would order an Uber. Ready to get your brand the attention it deserves? Visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://adquick.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠ today to start reaching your customers in the real world. – SEND US YOUR Q's FOR NOAH TO ANSWER ON AIR: [email protected] – FOLLOW ON X: @noahpinion @mattyglesias @eriktorenberg @turpentinemedia – RECOMMENDED IN THIS EPISODE: Noahpinion: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.noahpinion.blog/⁠⁠⁠⁠  Slow Boring: https://www.slowboring.com/podcast – TAKEAWAYS: America's Strategic Blindness: The US had momentum with the Inflation Reduction Act (IRA), which Noah calls "great industrial policy" that was working. However, because it was framed primarily as climate policy rather than technological/economic competition, Republicans killed it for culture war reasons, failing to understand its strategic importance. The Climate Framing Problem: Matt was prescient in warning that framing industrial policy purely through climate would create Republican backlash. Noah admits Matt was right - while climate messaging helped pass the IRA initially, it made the policies vulnerable to being seen as "just some climate thing" rather than crucial economic policy. The Obama Era Split: They trace how the 2000s gave their generation the "peace and love" progressive agenda (gay marriage, ending Iraq War), while the 2010s brought the "angry leftist" phase (riots, racial grievance politics) - unlike boomers who got both simultaneously. Missing the Bush Playbook: During Bush's cascading failures (Iraq, Katrina, financial crisis), Democrats effectively built a broad coalition and defined clear opposition. Today, despite Trump's obvious failures (tariffs, debt, vaccine skepticism), Democrats aren't capitalizing similarly. Narrow Target Strategy: Like successful campaigns in Australia, Democrats need to edit down their message to core critiques of Republican governance rather than trying to advance every progressive priority simultaneously. Big Tent Revival: The party succeeded in 2006-2008 by recruiting diverse candidates and standing behind pro-gun, even some pro-life Democrats to clarify what the core message was versus peripheral issues.
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  • India-Pakistan, Building Back Military Power, and Immigration
    This week, Noah Smith and Erik Torenberg examine global conflicts—especially India-Pakistan tensions—the U.S. military and industrial strategy amid rising threats from China, and the implications of AI and electrification, emphasizing the need for smarter immigration and industrial policies to maintain America's technological and geopolitical edge. – SPONSORS: NetSuite More than 41,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, the #1 cloud financial system bringing accounting, financial management, inventory, HR, into ONE proven platform. Download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine learning: ⁠⁠⁠https://netsuite.com/102⁠⁠⁠ AdQuick The easiest way to book out-of-home ads (like billboards, vehicle wraps, and airport displays) the same way you would order an Uber. Ready to get your brand the attention it deserves? Visit ⁠⁠⁠https://adquick.com/⁠⁠⁠ today to start reaching your customers in the real world. – SEND US YOUR Q's FOR NOAH TO ANSWER ON AIR: [email protected] – FOLLOW ON X: @noahpinion @eriktorenberg @turpentinemedia – RECOMMENDED IN THIS EPISODE: Noahpinion: ⁠⁠⁠https://www.noahpinion.blog/⁠⁠⁠  – TAKEAWAYS: India-Pakistan Conflict Analysis: Noah explains the territorial dispute over Kashmir dating back to the 1947 partition, with both countries claiming parts of each other's territory. America's Declining Global Influence: Noah argues we're seeing the "crumbling of Pax Americana" - reduced American deterrent effect allowing conflicts to escalate further. Critical Defense Industrial Base Concerns: America cannot match China's manufacturing capacity for military equipment, particularly missiles and drones. Economic Analysis - The Great Wage Stagnation: Wages stagnated for about 20 years, then resumed growth in the 1990s. Technology Transformation - The Electric Future: Battery and motor technology improvements are enabling electricity to replace combustion in cars, drones, appliances, and military equipment.
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  • The Middle Class Myth, China's Future, and What Really Happened in 1971
    This week, Noah Smith and Erik Torenberg debunk myths about the American middle class and globalization, analyze historical data on wage stagnation and trade, assess China’s technological rise, and discuss U.S. economic resilience and policy responses to protectionism. – SPONSORS: NetSuite More than 41,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, the #1 cloud financial system bringing accounting, financial management, inventory, HR, into ONE proven platform. Download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine learning: ⁠⁠https://netsuite.com/102⁠⁠ AdQuick The easiest way to book out-of-home ads (like billboards, vehicle wraps, and airport displays) the same way you would order an Uber. Ready to get your brand the attention it deserves? Visit ⁠⁠https://adquick.com/⁠⁠ today to start reaching your customers in the real world. – SEND US YOUR Q's FOR NOAH TO ANSWER ON AIR: [email protected] – FOLLOW ON X: @noahpinion @eriktorenberg @turpentinemedia – RECOMMENDED IN THIS EPISODE: Globalization did not hollow out the American middle class: https://www.noahpinion.blog/p/globalization-did-not-hollow-out Noahpinion: ⁠⁠https://www.noahpinion.blog/⁠⁠  – TAKEAWAYS: Debunking the Middle Class Hollowing Myth: Noah challenges the common narrative that trade and globalization hollowed out America's middle class. Manufacturing and Economic Shifts: Noah explains that while manufacturing employment did decline significantly (about 3 million jobs in the 2000s), this didn't correspond with overall middle class decline. The China Shock Reality: The "5% truth" in the middle class hollowing narrative relates to what economists call the "China Shock" - a period in the 2000s when Chinese imports surged rapidly. America's Globalization Status: Contrary to popular belief, America has never been highly globalized compared to other countries. Import penetration (imports relative to GDP) is much lower than in countries like China, France or Germany. Energy Crisis Impact: Noah suggests the oil shocks of 1973 and 1979 had a more significant impact on American manufacturing than trade policies. Sino-Futurism and China's Future: They discuss "Sino-futurism" - the idea that China represents the technological future. Noah argues this perspective is overblown, noting issues with China's rapid infrastructure development (like the durability of construction), urban planning problems, and the cyclical nature of technological leadership.
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O "Econ 102" with Noah Smith and Erik Torenberg

Economist and "Noahpinion" writer Noah Smith and investor Erik Torenberg make sense of what’s happening in the news, technology, business, and beyond, through the lens of economics. Econ 102 is a part of the Turpentine podcast network. Learn more: turpentine.co
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