Startups For the Rest of Us

How do you get LLMs to actually recommend your SaaS? 

In this episode, Rob Walling talks with Ross Hudgens, founder of Siege Media and author of the new book Generative Engine Optimization, about how SaaS companies get recommended by ChatGPT, Gemini, and the AI tools customers now use to shop. They cover why "best X" roundups and versus articles outperform, how much Reddit actually matters, and what a bootstrapped founder should do first to start showing up in AI search. 

Topics we cover:

(1:28) – SEO's evolution into GEO

(3:01) – Why Ross wrote his new AI SEO book

(3:58) – An S&P 100 client's SEO team gets laid off

(5:29) – Is GEO separate from traditional SEO?

(6:33) – Why publish "best category" roundup articles

(11:06) – Versus articles: an underrated GEO tactic

(14:14) – Handling competitor pushback on comparison pages

(16:57) – Recruiting YouTubers and using affiliate listings

(21:47) – Reddit's real influence on AI search

(25:38) – First GEO steps and how to measure visibility

Links from the show:

MicroConf US | April 18–20, 2027 · Austin, TX | Promocode: ROB50

TinySeed

Siege Media

Generative Engine Optimization: The Definitive Guide to AI SEO

Peec AI

G2

Capterra

PartnerStack

SelectSoftwareReviews

Technology Advice

SelectSoftware Reviews

Limelight 

Passionfroot

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you!

Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

Should you be worried that another founder will steal your idea if you ask them for advice?

In this episode, Rob is joined by Ruben Gamez to answer four listener questions: whether reaching out to more advanced founders puts your idea at risk, how to convince big name customers to agree to a case study, what to do when a platform ecosystem (like Shopify's app store) turns hostile, and how to sell a B2G SaaS product when your sales cycle only runs during the hours you're already at a day job.

Want to get your question answered? Submit your question for an upcoming episode.

Topics we cover:

(1:59) – Fear that outreach could get an idea stolen

(3:50) – Why no one actually steals ideas

(9:12) – Getting copied is inevitable once you're public

(13:45) – How to land big brand case studies

(15:39) – Using discounts to secure case studies

(18:11) – Shopify's fake review extortion

(20:21) – Should you move to a standalone SaaS

(25:06) – B2G SaaS around a day job

(28:29) – Why GovTech rarely attracts angel investment

Links from the show:

Tiny Summit | December 5–7, 2026 · Cancun, Mexico

TinySeed SaaS Institute

MicroConf

SignWell

Ruben Gamez (@earthlingworks) | X

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you!

Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

How do you pivot your SaaS when things aren’t working?

This week Rob talks with Nathan Tyler, founder of BlinkMetrics, about the messy, uncertain process of finding product market fit in real time. Nathan walks through why his original EOS scorecard idea didn't work, how hundreds of coffee chats led to a done for you reporting business, and why he just launched a second product, BlinkPages, right in the middle of it all.

Topics we cover:

(2:43) – The Staging Pilot exit to Pantheon

(4:44) – BlinkMetrics origin story

(5:59) – 104 coffee chats, real revenue

(8:09) – Why not launch 12 products in 12 weeks

(9:39) – Launching a second product: BlinkPages

(13:09) – Squarespace to BlinkPages migration

(17:03) – Why static sites beat WordPress now

(21:02) – Knowing when to pivot

(25:26) – Market pull vs. shiny object

(32:10) – Pricing migrations, hosting, and AI costs

Links from the show:

Get your Ticket for MicroConf US - Austin, Texas on April 18 - 20, 2027 | Use promo code ROB50 

BlinkMetrics

BlinkPages

The SaaS Playbook

Exit Strategy Book

Nathan Tyler | LinkedIn 

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you!

Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

How do you onboard a hire onto a codebase you built alone?

In this episode, Derrick Reimer joins Rob to tackle four listener questions. They cover hiring and onboarding your first developer as a bootstrapped founder, then move into the temptation to build features just because AI makes them cheap to ship, getting past social anxiety as a founder, and whether it's worth trademarking your product name.

Topics we cover:

(3:59) – How do you hire your first developer?  

(5:14) – Qualities to look for in a first developer hire

(13:37) – Onboarding a new hire into your codebase with AI

(16:49) – Reducing hiring risk: pairing, reliability, recruiters

(22:50) – The temptation to build features just because AI makes it cheap

(30:43) – Getting over social anxiety as a founder

(35:25) – Is trademarking your product name worth it?

Links from the show:

TinySummit | December 5–7, 2026 · JW Marriott, Cancun

MicroConf US | April 18–20, 2027 · Austin, TX

Partnerships: sponsors@microconf.com

Idea to Traction: Stop Building SaaS Nobody Wants (book wait list)

Rob Walling Newsletter

Remote First Recruiting 

SavvyCal

Derrick Reimer | LinkedIn

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you!

Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify

Ever gotten a vague cease and desist from a competitor and wondered if you actually did something wrong?

This week I tackle four listener questions: how seriously to take competitor terms of service threats, whether AI is really a platform risk (or just a feature risk), how to build confidence and get past the fear of reaching out to prospects, and when a non-founder employee should walk away from a company that's missing founder activation energy.

Want to get your question answered? Submit your question for an upcoming episode.

Episode Sponsor:

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Topics we cover:

(01:05) – Are terms of service threats legitimate?

(04:25) – No attorney-client privilege with LLMs

(06:39) – AI as platform risk explained

(08:21) – Will AI subsume your features?

(10:55) – Will AI costs drop over time?

(14:22) – Mitigating LLM downtime risk

(16:06) – Structuring an enterprise pilot program

(17:56) – Building confidence despite social anxiety

(23:05) – When to quit as a non-founder

Links from the show:

Idea to Traction: Stop Building SaaS Nobody Wants (book wait list) 

Rob Walling Newsletter

TinySeed Portfolio

TinySeed Accelerator

Rob Walling YouTube Channel 

MicroConf

The SaaS Playbook

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you'd like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We'd love to hear from you!

Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify