It Was What It Was : The Football History Podcast

Welcome back to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. Today co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper are joined by a very special returning guest - Jan Fjørtoft! In this first part of a four-part series, we will explore Norway’s remarkable rise in the early 1990s and their famous 2–0 win over Graham Taylor’s England in 1993. Fjørtoft explains how Egil “Drillo” Olsen took a previously struggling national team and built belief through a disciplined, direct style, carefully defined roles, and detailed match analysis using hand-written stats and video. The episode breaks down the key tactical choices that unsettled England, revisits both Norway goals, and follows the qualifier run that took Norway to their first World Cup since 1938. Norway will return to the World Cup this summer for the first time since 1998.

01:12 Norway before the rise
04:09 Olsen arrives and stirs
06:47 Direct football philosophy
14:31 Stats and analysis
20:05 Defined roles and system
23:40 Beating England
28:12 Tactical switch
31:33 Gascoigne fitness factor
32:50 Olsen’s Selection Mind Games
37:20 Two Goals Breakdown
42:41 Road to USA 94 Sealed
45:45 Poland Night and Wild Celebrations
48:46 Heroes Welcome in Norway
52:04 World Cup Heat Prep Fiasco
59:59 Egil Olsen Legacy

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Today, Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper take you back to the 1966 FIFA World Cup.
On home soil in England, the hosts claimed their first and only World Cup title. Captain Bobby Moore marshalled the side with composure, while Geoff Hurst rose to immortality with a historic hat-trick in the final. England’s triumph, sealed in a dramatic victory over West Germany, remains one of the most iconic moments in football history and the nations greatest footballing day.
You can listen to the full episode on Patreon, along with the below privileges:

BONUS EDITIONS
Exclusive deep dives, specials & extended conversations from one-off specials to extra episodes that expand on our weekly free shows, you’ll get fresh, members-only content - including our “Bonus Editions” strand where Rob and Jonathan go deeper into football’s biggest stories and hidden histories.

WORLD CUP WEDNESDAYS!
Our countdown to 2026 - every tournament revisited Join Rob and Jonathan as they walk through every World Cup from 1930 to today, exploring the drama, evolution, legends, controversies and cultural impact of each tournament.

RETRO MAGAZINE COLLECTION
Flicking through the archives of classic football culture A nostalgic series diving into the pages of Shoot! and other retro football magazines - revisiting the stars, forgotten features, and football fandom of decades past.

MONTHLY LIVE Q&A WITH ROB & JONATHAN
Your chance to ask two of football’s leading writers anything. Submit your questions about recent episodes, football history, their journalism, or upcoming projects — and hear their answers in our LIVE members-only Q&A.

JOIN THE IT WAS COMMUNITY
Connect with fellow fans & nostalgia lovers Meet other members who share your passion for football history. Be part of the conversation and help shape the future of the show.

What’s included
Exclusive content
Q&As
Ad-free episodes
Private community

Follow the link here - or go to Patreon.com and search for It Was What It Was
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Welcome to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. This week, co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper are joined by an extraudinary guest - Clyde Best. An absolute pioneer to the game, born in Bermuda, Clyde would become one of the first black players in First Division football in England. His new film, ‘Transforming the Beautiful Game: The Clyde Best Story’ will be shown for a week at Sadler’s Wells East from 25th March.

In this episode, Clyde recounts arriving in England as a teenager, getting lost at West Ham station and being taken in by the Charles family. He reflects on his rise at West Ham, getting his debut against Arsenal under Ron Greenwood in 1969 and playing alongside the likes of Bobby Moore, Geoff Hurst and Martin Peters. Clyde talks of the his Bermuda upbringing, national team breakthrough and the influence that his father had on him. Best reflects on being one of the first prominent black players in English football, enduring racist abuse and an acid-attack threat and playing against Pelé. He also discusses NASL moves to Tampa Bay and Portland Timbers and the inspiration he provided players such as Ian Wright.

01:29 Lost at Heathrow
03:23 The Charles Family
06:59 Bermuda Beginnings
10:20 West Ham Dream
13:20 Ron Greenwood Impact
15:22 Fast Track Debut
18:35 Breaking Barriers
24:06 Facing Racism
31:03 Scoring Against Pelé
35:20 Leaving West Ham for the NASL
37:17 American Soccer Showmanship
43:01 Legacy as a Pioneer
46:57 Honorary Doctorate
49:44 His love for West Ham

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Welcome back to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. In this final part three of our three-part special on Colombian football and the tragedy of Andrés Escobar.

Co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper tell the story of the 1994 World Cup and its devastating aftermath. This episode explores the immense and impossible pressure placed on the Colombian squad, from death threats delivered to hotel room TVs, to the chaos of a nation in civil war pinning all its hopes on eleven men. The discussion covers the Romania defeat, the fateful own goal against the USA, and the senseless murder of Andrés Escobar outside a nightclub. Rob and Jonathan also examine the legacy of Escobar 'the gentleman of football' and his remarkable fiancée Pamela Cascada, before reflecting on Colombia's long road to recovery and redemption.

You can listen to this episode ad-free over on our Patreon - Follow the link here - or go to Patreon.com and search for It Was What It Was. You will also get access to our World Cup countdown, magazine retrospectives and bonus episodes as well as a monthly Q&A with Rob and Jonathan.

01:00 Andrés Escobar's Posthumous Column in El Tiempo
01:55 Setting the Scene: The Narco State & Pablo Escobar's Death
06:55 Pablo Escobar's Deep Love of Football
10:55 Francisco Maturana on the Narcos: "Like an Octopus"
16:30 Andrés Escobar: El Caballero del Fútbol
20:25 A Move to AC Milan & The Burden of Representing Colombia
23:30 Higuita's Exclusion & The President's Calculations
26:00 The Romania Defeat: Hagi's Moment of Magic
27:45 Death Threats, Kidnappings & Maturana in Tears
33:00 The USA Game: Playing Under the Shadow of Snipers
35:30 The Own Goal & Colombia's Elimination
37:15 The Murder of Andrés Escobar
41:00 Who Killed Escobar? The Galón Brothers & the Cover-Up
44:45 The State Funeral & Pamela Cascada's Dignity
48:15 The Aftermath: Colombia's Slow Road to Redemption
51:45 2014 & The Restoration of Colombian Football Pride
54:15 Closing Thoughts
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In this sneak peek to a bonus episode of It Was What It Was on Patreon, hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper are joined by Professor Matthew Brown (University of Bristol) to deepen the series on Andrés Escobar by tracing how Colombian history, political violence and the drug economy intersect with football. Brown rejects Gabriel García Márquez’s claim that three events defined 20th-century Colombia, while explaining why the 5–0 win over Argentina in 1993 became a tipping point for football as a national identity marker. The discussion covers football’s emergence alongside other sporting cultures, the role of sport after the 1948 Bogotazo and during La Violencia, and Colombia’s later shift into guerrilla conflict and cocaine trafficking. They explore cartel money’s social and sporting influence, the effects of Pablo Escobar’s death and subsequent violence, the symbolic damage of Colombia’s 1994 World Cup collapse, Copa América 2001, and how the 2014 team helped build trust during negotiations leading to the 2016 peace deal, while noting ongoing violence tied to the illegal drug trade.

You can listen to the full episode on Patreon

On Tuesday, Rob Draper and Jonathan Wilson return to round off the Colombia series and bring that story to a close.

On Wednesday, on Patreon only, the co-hosts continue the World Cup countdown series with an episode on the 1962 World Cup in Chile, looking back at the tournament and some of its key moments.

Then on Friday, also on Patreon only, we look back at when Northern Ireland faced Italy in the 1958 World Cup qualifiers. With Northern Ireland preparing for their 2026 World Cup play-off semi-final against Italy, Rob and Jonathan revisit the meeting where Northern Ireland qualified for their first World Cup and discuss the background to Ireland’s football split in the 1950s.
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